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Song arranging for dummies?

T

TMe

Senior Member
Is it possible or realistic to learn music theory and start arranging songs using nothing but software, or is it necessary to learn how to play a harmonic instrument like keys or guitar first?
I'd like to take existing songs and shift them from one genre to another, simplifying them, and providing a rough sketch for a basic bar band to work with. So I'm talking about fairly basic stuff.
I assume I'd need to study music theory, but I'm hoping I don't need to spend a few years learning to play piano first.
Any thoughts? Any software recommendations?
 
there is a famous composer - John Mackey - for band and drum corps who never played an instrument, and learned music theory by studying it out of books and learned how to apply it by figuring out video game music. This was all pre-internet. So it definitely can be done.
 
TMe said:
I'd like to take existing songs and shift them from one genre to another, simplifying them, and providing a rough sketch for a basic bar band to work with.
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Most genres have pretty clear conventions, which can be learned. One can play a reggae beat behind Achy-Breaky Heart, tell the guitarist and bassist to play in a reggae style and you are most of the way there with minimal book learnin'. Extend one section, trim another and you just arranged a song.

Learning to play in different styles yourself will likely get you in touch with other versatile musicians who get it. If not, text YouTube video explaining the conventions of (in this example) reggae on specific instruments to the players and rehearse.

If the desire is to be the boss, be a good one.
 
My musical theory is, by my own reckoning, limited. My school band education in melodic instruments didn't go much past learning major scales. This hasn't stopped me from learning enough guitar and bass (on my own, by ear, via YT, etc.) to write about half the songs my original band currently plays. My foundation in rhythm and a wide range of musical styles and influences as a drummer has helped make up for my deficiencies in melodic arrangement, and I have a couple of excellent musicians as bandmates who do a great job of turning what I write into gold.
 
so I had 3 years of Theory in college for my Music Ed degree

I have been arranging and writing music for band, percussion ensemble, competitive drumline and jazz band for over 20 years...and have never used anything that I learned past midway through the 2nd year.

I mostly use knowledge of the difference between major and minor scales, and then basic to intermediate chord theory. In my situation, knowledge of wind instrument ranges, and some more "physical" things was actually more challenging in the beginning.

I don't read theory as quickly as I probably should - like when studying a score - but apply it pretty quickly, and knowledge of the basic stuff makes it quicker for me to get the stuff I hear in my head on to paper...or computer screen
 
You can do it in rehearsal by just telling people what to do. If you want to write lead sheets, there's probably a Berklee book that covers it, what they're supposed to look like, what information is supposed to be in them. For actually making them you'd probably want a keyboard to help figture out keys, melody, chords, any composed figures/vamps/whatever. Shouldn't take any kind of skill actually playing the piano. You'd need to know what notes make up what/what kind of scales and chords.
 
toddbishop said:
You can do it in rehearsal by just telling people what to do. If you want to write lead sheets, there's probably a Berklee book that covers it, what they're supposed to look like, what information is supposed to be in them. For actually making them you'd probably want a keyboard to help figture out keys, melody, chords, any composed figures/vamps/whatever. Shouldn't take any kind of skill actually playing the piano. You'd need to know what notes make up what/what kind of scales and chords.
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Agreed. It's called "arranger's piano," and for that you can be a total hack. I am a very bad piano player, but learning how it's laid out and what the notes are made learning theory a LOT easier.

And while it's possible to learn theory with software, it makes it much easier to learn if you have an actual piano keyboard, and a cheapo $50 keyboard will do fine for learning purposes.
 
toddbishop said:
You can do it in rehearsal by just telling people what to do. If you want to write lead sheets, there's probably a Berklee book that covers it, what they're supposed to look like, what information is supposed to be in them. For actually making them you'd probably want a keyboard to help figture out keys, melody, chords, any composed figures/vamps/whatever. Shouldn't take any kind of skill actually playing the piano. You'd need to know what notes make up what/what kind of scales and chords.
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yeah...I can't play the piano, but I can figure stuff out on it when I write...like I know how to do a major chord, and all the inversions etc, but can string it together in a song. I can do that on marimba much quicker...
 
Xstr8edgtnrdrmrX said:
so I had 3 years of Theory in college for my Music Ed degree

I have been arranging and writing music for band, percussion ensemble, competitive drumline and jazz band for over 20 years...and have never used anything that I learned past midway through the 2nd year.
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Yeah, you can deep dive theory and learn all sorts of esoteric stuff you likely won't use, but it's nice to know there's always something to learn from it.
 
JimmyM said:
Agreed. It's called "arranger's piano," and for that you can be a total hack. I am a very bad piano player, but learning how it's laid out and what the notes are made learning theory a LOT easier.

And while it's possible to learn theory with software, it makes it much easier to learn if you have an actual piano keyboard, and a cheapo $50 keyboard will do fine for learning purposes.
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seeing you post reminded me that I do a LOT of writing and arranging on bass...
 
PorkPieGuy said:
I'd say learning the Nashville Numbering System would be a good start.
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Nashville number system is very much a skill in demand for musicians these days. I don’t think it’s understandable until you learn chord theory, though. Then you understand the reason for it…to be easier to transpose if you need to change the key on the fly.
 
JimmyM said:
And while it's possible to learn theory with software, it makes it much easier to learn if you have an actual piano keyboard, and a cheapo $50 keyboard will do fine for learning purposes.
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Just bought for exactly this purpose. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07NBWYMNQ?ref=ppx_pop_dt_b_asin_title&th=1 It's a "kids" model (slightly smaller keys) but works just fine. Comes with headphones & "mic" which I tossed in the trash can right off.

Scrolled Craigslist for a bit, then realized I could get a new one with stand and bench delivered right to my door for about $50 more than driving around looking.
 
Thanks for all the replies. It sounds like learning "arrangers piano" is in my future, and some ear training.
As for software, I might start by using MuseScore. It's rather clunky, but it's free and I'm already familiar with it. I've looked at a few other packages, but the learning curve was so steep I can't see investing that much time when all I want to do is very basic stuff. If I can map out the chord changes, that should be enough.
 
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I have been arranging and composing since my 2nd year of high school and, for good or bad, I have only acquired absolute minimum piano skills. I can plunk out notes and chords as needed - but have virtually zero ability to perform on the piano, even at the level of young beginner.

Would this go better with more piano chops? More than likely. Have I ever gotten myself to set aside the time to actually learn to play the piano? Nope.

My advice - if you can find that time and choose to do it - great! But don't set aside your desire to start learning how to write until after acquiring those piano chops. There's no need - you can do both concurrently.
 
TMe said:
Thanks for all the replies. It sounds like learning "arrangers piano" is in my future, and some ear training.
As for software, I might start by using MuseScore. It's rather clunky, but it's free and I'm already familiar with it. I've looked at a few other packages, but the learning curve was so steep I can't see investing that much time when all I want to do is very basic stuff. If I can map out the chord changes, that should be enough.
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I wouldn't start with a notation software - I'd start with a DAW. A DAW with some decent virtual instruments along with a midi keyboard will you to far quicker explore the creative process of this. And the vast amount of learning is all about figuring out what's possible and how to do it musically. A DAW allows you to just more easily work with the notes directly. Notation programs are first and foremost about that... notation.

If you were already well versed in theory and traditional score writing, then a notation program would be a great workbench to be working on. But if you're not, then it will just drastically slow you down. You'll possibly end up needing notation someday - but possibly not. Again if you are not already well versed in creating written scores a notation software is not where you want to start.

I swear by Logic Pro on the mac - for $200 comes complete with every thing you could possibly need for years of study and creation. But frankly, any DAW would serve you well - Cubase, GarageBand, Reaper (you'll need to add some virtual instruments), Albeton, Digital Performer, etc. - any a better place to start with than MuseScore or any other notation platform.

Good luck and have fun.
 
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