Zildjian Cymbal reintroduction

I got annoyed with Zildjian all over again this week-- I was showing some Cymbal & Gong cymbals to my brother in Seattle, and one of his employees at Origin Records brought a Zildjian prototype, that was best Zildjian I've played in years-- almost as good as the things I brought. Steve Gadd dropped it off at a local store, and the guy got it for ~$150. Bugs me that someone has to luck onto the one accidental cymbal. Just make the things, quit dancing around.

Anyway, here are my brother-- John Bishop, and Evan Woodle playing some C&G stuff:

 
who ordered him "just do the Elvin thing... and try and stay away from the bells".. ? 😁
 
toddbishop said:
and one of his employees at Origin Records brought a Zildjian prototype, that was best Zildjian I've played in years-- almost as good as the things I brought. Steve Gadd dropped it off at a local store, and the guy got it for ~$150
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what was it.. diameter 18/20? and could you tell series hint.. describe her a bit +/- thks
was it a K Session proto 18? etc
 
toddbishop said:
I got annoyed with Zildjian all over again this week-- I was showing some Cymbal & Gong cymbals to my brother in Seattle, and one of his employees at Origin Records brought a Zildjian prototype, that was best Zildjian I've played in years-- almost as good as the things I brought. Steve Gadd dropped it off at a local store, and the guy got it for ~$150. Bugs me that someone has to luck onto the one accidental cymbal. Just make the things, quit dancing around.

Anyway, here are my brother-- John Bishop, and Evan Woodle playing some C&G stuff:

Click to expand...
I fail to see the point of your post other than slagging zildjian, and uplifting cymbal and gong (or the cymbals “you are holding right now”).

I thought this topic is about the new kerope’s?

Also.

Be happy that Zildjian sound lab prototype cymbals can be found in the open.

As they were never intended for sales but only to get feedback from players.

Zildjian just got the bad luck they make for good investments.

Prototype cymbals by other brands don’t get near close that traffic.
 
DutchDrummersDreams said:
Be happy that Zildjian sound lab prototype cymbals can be found in the open.

As they were never intended for sales but only to get feedback from players.

Zildjian just got the bad luck they make for good investments.

Prototype cymbals by other brands don’t get near close that traffic.
Click to expand...
These cymbals are absolutely intended for sales, they're just not mass produced and ready to be in the catalog lineup. Selling these is part of how they recoup some of the R&D costs. They can also float something to the market without classifying it under a specific line.
 
DutchDrummersDreams said:
I fail to see the point of your post other than slagging zildjian, and uplifting cymbal and gong (or the cymbals “you are holding right now”).
Click to expand...

My point was that I was annoyed that I had to find a cymbal I liked by accident, and it was a one-off. There's no personalized thing of "slagging" anyone, I'm talking about a very large business and the instruments they make, and the business decisions they make.

I mention Cymbal & Gong because I just met with some drummers to play them, and that's where the comparison happened, and I had some video of it. I also mentioned earlier that Agop and Bosphorus and other brands also make excellent cymbals, and have been doing so the whole time people have been waiting for the new line under discussion.

But I'm happy to promote them or uplift them at every opportunity.

DutchDrummersDreams said:
I thought this topic is about the new kerope’s?
Click to expand...

You know how it goes over seven pages, the topic tends to drift as people say things that interest them, and other people respond.

I did say before it looks like they're decent cymbals, and that I wish they hadn't waited til 2025 to make them.

DutchDrummersDreams said:
Also.

Be happy that Zildjian sound lab prototype cymbals can be found in the open.

As they were never intended for sales but only to get feedback from players.

Zildjian just got the bad luck they make for good investments.

Prototype cymbals by other brands don’t get near close that traffic.
Click to expand...

Not much of investment here, my guy bought it for ~$150, and will never sell it for more than that because it has a bend in it.

I'm happy when I can get good cymbals. When I play a protype that is, for my purposes, better than the regular production, I wonder now, where were you this whole time?

Which is the other point I was getting at earlier, when businesses get into massive volume the priorities shift, and I felt like that's what was happening with this company, that they didn't seem to be focused on making great product for people in my little corner of the market.
 
Zildjian has produced some wonderful sounding cymbals, some average cymbals and some clangers over the years.

I think terms like "recipe" and secret formulas used in instrument sales should be kept in perspective...at the end of the day it's a just a disc of metal not a life saving drug.

Obtaining a trade secret can create an aura of mystique:
"In some instances, companies use their trade secret status to not only gain protection, but to gain notoriety. By promoting the idea, for example, that a recipe for something like Krispy Kreme doughnut mix or KFC chicken batter is known only to a select few individuals, marketers can create buzz."


The "family held secret" notion is a quaint anachronism in the information age. That's why patents exist.
 
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BenOBrienSmith said:
These cymbals are absolutely intended for sales, they're just not mass produced and ready to be in the catalog lineup. Selling these is part of how they recoup some of the R&D costs. They can also float something to the market without classifying it under a specific line.
Click to expand...

Maybe that is something from the current era?

I only play Sound Lab cymbals (my first was a 22” K brilliant crash owned by Zak Starkey) and when I started playing these by accident, one could only get them used from artists who didn’t had need for them.

I noticed only in more recent years retailers started selling them too and they made more than one of one run.

Now they even have the Concept Shop (prototypes with a different logo and even more items made in a run).
 
DutchDrummersDreams said:
Maybe that is something from the current era?

I only play Sound Lab cymbals (my first was a 22” K brilliant crash owned by Zak Starkey) and when I started playing these by accident, one could only get them used from artists who didn’t had need for them.

I noticed only in more recent years retailers started selling them too and they made more than one of one run.

Now they even have the Concept Shop (prototypes with a different logo and even more items made in a run).
Click to expand...
The Sound Lab Prototypes have been for sale through certain outlets for at least 15 years now. Concept Shop was an effort to expand the run size and float product ideas to the larger market.
 
BenOBrienSmith said:
The Sound Lab Prototypes have been for sale through certain outlets for at least 15 years now. Concept Shop was an effort to expand the run size and float product ideas to the larger market.
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Just out of curiosity, what are those outlets? In Europe I don't think I've ever seen a Sound Lab cymbal, must be something over in the states...
 
Claymorexz said:
Just out of curiosity, what are those outlets? In Europe I don't think I've ever seen a Sound Lab cymbal, must be something over in the states...
Click to expand...
I can't speak to their sale outside of the states but they've been available at in-store events, some of the old "5 Star Drum Shops" in smaller quantities, and at shows like PASIC.
 
Comments and sound check by John Riley.

Zildjian 20" Kerope Medium Thin Low Ride Cymbal.
Zildjian 22" Kerope Medium Thin High Ride Cymbal.

 
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20 or 30 old Ks John. Two more than me and last night an old K 20" with three rivets from 68 New Stamp performed perfectly did everything I wanted it* to and more.
Nice vid nice and quick.
*and two 14s 30s Con bottom 50s III top
I think one answer to cymbals is "suit the room" whatever your room may be,
 
oh new post alert on this subject; I thought maybe the First Warranty Claim was submitted; by a drunken jazzist who slipped into a Keith Moon mode and knocked the bell clean out of a 2025 Kerope. no? all Gooood..
 
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Intermediate Era is an odd era of Old Ks to go after and that's the (sound build) era that was chosen for this 2025 release.
There's two Other Sound build Eras to get to.

40-58 Old stamp era- frost butterfly breath
59-66 Intermediate era- Dry Dark middle freq. hole
67-72-78 New Stamp era- warm mushrooms most like the modern handmade cymbals that came after in the 80s

I can hear the Intermediate era characteristics this mission/project went by went after and somewhat achieved

Intermediate were (are) bright and low with a middle frequency missing. Reason: flat profile (lows) and tall bell (highs) no bone thrown to the mids - Just the way it happened for the Period 59-66 nothing forethought or 'on' purpose- just where and how the company was 'at' and did it - those years

there's three Eras of Ks Three sound eras. Old, Intermediate and New
This 2025 recreation is of one of them as stated in the text literature- Intermediate.

They got two more to go if they choose to.
Intermediates Dry Dark Ice Middle Freq Hole
The Team pretty much captured that

But frankly in my humble opinion the oddest era to tackle- unless there's future plans (I mean 20 years from now) to complete the Recapture
Own 6 Intermediate original my self
and 10 New Stamps and 2 or 3 Old stamps
 
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