Stain mixing for color matching

W

w

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I think Yamaha must still be mixing by hand for the Stage Customs.
Hard to believe they don't have some kind of computerized color mixing for exact matches.

I ordered a spare 12" Natural Wood tom. I really like the color of the tom on the right in the pic. The one that arrived is the one on the left.
I was hoping for the darker, more golden color, but the one I got is more yellowish.
The previous SC sets I had that were called Natural Wood, had a stain that almost looked like a plain clear coat with no added color.
Might be a heads up for anyone getting a set with the idea of getting add on toms later.
Even though the sets have the same name , there can be a wide variation in the actual colors.




SC Color mismatch - Copy.jpg
 
TheDrummerFromAmsterdam said:
Interesting.

How old it the tom on the right?
Click to expand...

July, 2021. Just about two years ago.
But even if it was 20 years, an automated system should be able to get very close, even accounting for minor wood variations.

When I bought the set, GC had a tag on it that said it was Honey Amber,
but I've got a couple HA toms and they are very dark orangish in comparison.
Natural Wood on the left, and Honey Amber on the right:

NW_HA - Copy.jpg

IMO, the colors in this series are very inconsistent.
 
wildbill said:
July, 2021. Just about two years ago.
But even if it was 20 years, an automated system should be able to get very close, even accounting for minor wood variations.

When I bought the set, GC had a tag on it that said it was Honey Amber,
but I've got a couple HA toms and they are very dark orangish in comparison.
Natural Wood on the left, and Honey Amber on the right:

View attachment 134347

IMO, the colors in this series are very inconsistent.
Click to expand...
I haven’t heard about these mis match error’s in laquer yet.

It reminds me of Vintage Natural which ages to a bronze finish over time.
2 years (especially in sun) did this on that finish.
Here is a good example of some Daxdad’s I had.
One saw Uv over the years, the other didn’t yet.
CB6B5CE5-8A78-4EC2-A0A8-6800D95CF58F.jpeg
1F2BD904-E9AD-4DF0-A924-70FC64BB9943.jpeg

Hence why I asked for its age.

Still if this was the case, they should have mentioned this as disclaimer.

I would take it up with the rep so they can help you out.

Over thousands of shell’s made its not something I would say they completely dropped in QC, but it needs to be addressed nonetheless and make this right for you.
 
TheDrummerFromAmsterdam said:
I haven’t heard about these mis match error’s in laquer yet.

It reminds me of Vintage Natural which ages to a bronze finish over time.
2 years (especially in sun) did this on that finish.....
Click to expand...

These didn't age (yet) - they look the same as when I got them:

Yamaha Stage Custom

Picked up a set with a nice sale price. Made a few changes to them. I think they look and sound good.
www.drummerworld.com

I did have a Vintage Natural Maple Custom Absolute set that aged nicely, but I sold that one.

my Yamaha Absolute Hybrid Maple

Hello just would like to share a few pics of my new baby Yamaha Absolute Hybrid Maple in vintage natural finish. I'm consistently in awe of this kit, the looks, the built quality, the sound...nothing short of amazing. The price point is spot on too. Even the sound engineers and all the other...
www.drummerworld.com

I got this current tom at a discount price already, so I'm not complaining too much.
I think it was a return - maybe for the color. I don't really see any other issues.
Even if I was playing gigs with them, I could probably live with it.
If it's a common problem though, I think Yamaha should address it.
 
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Actually it was part of the boxed kit though I obtained some add ons which pretty much matched the original set except the darker green.
 
I think only dw allows for true matching when buying the kit and getting add ons later

The color you get is what you get with chinese made kits. Warranty also claims color deviations are.not defects. I dont know if a boxed kit can be returned for slight color mismatches.

I have seen yamaha stages at GC that are slightly off from one piece to the other.
 
wildbill said:
Hard to believe they don't have some kind of computerized color mixing for exact matches.
Click to expand...
That’s been my question to every paint and stain salesman for decades. Why can’t I custom mix my own stain colors like I can paint?
Just give me a clear base, put the drops in it like they already do for off the shelf colors and I’ll be on my way!!

Think of the possibilities if you could just take this drum in, they scan it like paint departments do a paint chip and you’d be good to go!

I understand shade variations as wood ages, but come on. If they can put a man on the moon, why can’t I custom mix my own stain?
 
It's not so much the stain as the shade of the outer veneer which may darken the color of the stain after it is applied. The folks on the mass production lines are not first matching the finishes and then staining.

Picking a fade finish or other complex scheme is probably the best way to avoid mismatches.

I have an 8, 10, 12, 13.and 14 rack setup and the 10 sticks out as the ugly duckling.. Drums sound terrific nonetheless.
 
Cmdr. Ross said:
That’s been my question to every paint and stain salesman for decades. Why can’t I custom mix my own stain colors like I can paint?
Just give me a clear base, put the drops in it like they already do for off the shelf colors and I’ll be on my way!!

Think of the possibilities if you could just take this drum in, they scan it like paint departments do a paint chip and you’d be good to go!

I understand shade variations as wood ages, but come on. If they can put a man on the moon, why can’t I custom mix my own stain?
Click to expand...
We have machines for that at a lot of construction stores.
 
Donnie67 said:
It's not so much the stain as the shade of the outer veneer which may darken the color of the stain after it is applied. The folks on the mass production lines are not first matching the finishes and then staining.

Picking a fade finish or other complex scheme is probably the best way to avoid mismatches.

I have an 8, 10, 12, 13.and 14 rack setup and the 10 sticks out as the ugly duckling.. Drums sound terrific nonetheless.
Click to expand...

Not sure how they do it, but normally some type of wood conditioner is used first, so that the stain applies evenly.
The conditioner should also minimize color variations in the outer ply.
If they use off the shelf, pre-mixed stain, it doesn't seem like there should be such major differences in the final hue.
 
wildbill said:
Not sure how they do it, but normally some type of wood conditioner is used first, so that the stain applies evenly.
The conditioner should also minimize color variations in the outer ply.
If they use off the shelf, pre-mixed stain, it doesn't seem like there should be such major differences in the final hue.
Click to expand...

But light natural finishes do age. It's not something you might notice on your own drums, because it's happening in slow motion, but time and light have an effect on the wood that leads to a color change in the finish.

Here's a great example of how exposure to light can make a natural finish head toward amber. I'm sure the first person to take those lugs off was surprised just how much darker the shell had become since it was new and I doubt they noticed the change because it happens gradually.

s-l1600.jpg
 
Winston_Wolf said:
But light natural finishes do age. It's not something you might notice on your own drums, because it's happening in slow motion, but time and light have an effect on the wood that leads to a color change in the finish.....
Click to expand...

Yep - you're right. I'm just going to leave it sit outside for 40 years. :ROFLMAO:


But the thread was actually about new finishes that don't match.
 
wildbill said:
Yep - you're right. I'm just going to leave it sit outside for 40 years. :ROFLMAO:


But the thread was actually about new finishes that don't match.
Click to expand...

New, or two years old vs. new?

Two years might not seem like a long time, but I'd be surprised if there hadn't been some degree of change already. Have you removed a lug or two on a drum from your first set to see if there has been any change?
 
I linked in post #6 to pics from when I first got the set.
They still look the same as those pics.
I'm sure if I pulled a lug, there might be a tiny little bit of color change underneath, but nothing like the drastic difference between the two toms.

It won't matter after I paint them all black though. :ROFLMAO:

EDIT: OK - you got me curious enough to pull a lug off.
Granted, these drums haven't left my basement since I got them, but if you can see aging or a color change under the lug, your eyes are better than mine:
 

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Cmdr. Ross said:
That’s been my question to every paint and stain salesman for decades. Why can’t I custom mix my own stain colors like I can paint?
Just give me a clear base, put the drops in it like they already do for off the shelf colors and I’ll be on my way!!

Think of the possibilities if you could just take this drum in, they scan it like paint departments do a paint chip and you’d be good to go!

I understand shade variations as wood ages, but come on. If they can put a man on the moon, why can’t I custom mix my own stain?
Click to expand...
I'm pretty sure this is exactly what you can do with wood dye and tinting clear coat.
 
microkit said:
I'm pretty sure this is exactly what you can do with wood dye and tinting clear coat.
Click to expand...
I thought so too, but when I ask I'm told "It doesn't work that way. It's all done at the factory with special equipment".
What backs that up is how I can't find clear stain base or color mix-in bottles to do anything outside of what's offered on the shelf.

Ace Hardware, Home Depot, Lowes et al carry none of this & even online resources only use what's already on the shelf.

Maybe one day they'll give us, the consumer the power to go beyond paint for custom colors. Not now it seems.
 
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